|
|
| Red Faction : [RED] Editing : Bevelling Airbrushes and Portals |
[Forum Rules] |
| Enforce |
  Posted 9th Aug 2007 6:02am |
L4Y Member
Post 75 / 312
 |
Creating a room air brush, then bevelling the ceiling down to make it lower
and then trying to place a portal inside that causes the portal to have holes
or even if the screen turns white after fiddling with the portal, clicking on
show room in different colors, shows the room in the same color, (portal
says its ok, but didn't portal off the map.......)
So looks like you can't use portals in air brushes that have been bevelled. |
| Red limits breached?, Yep, (20,000 fces and its still going !) |
|
|
Assman15  |
Posted 9th Aug 2007 10:54am |  |
Post 493 / 2085
 |
Try making the portal brush (I assume you're using a face-type brush) larger tan the dimensions of the room. For example, if the room is 4x4, make the portal 5x5 so it sticks out by 0.5 on each end. This can usually solve minor portal issues. |
|
|
| Enforce |
Posted 9th Aug 2007 12:02pm |
L4Y Member
Post 77 / 312
|
Yeah, apparently just as you should not cross the navigation paths, it seems you can't cross bevelled airbrushes with portals or with other air brushes, for they result in
instabiilty or holes or make portals unstable and not function properly.
So I think its only safe to place a portal where there is no bevelled part of the airbrush.
This is probably one of the main reasons why most of the portals are inside the doors
to avoid this conflict. |
| Red limits breached?, Yep, (20,000 fces and its still going !) |
Modified Aug 9th, 12:14pm by Enforce |
|
| goober |
Posted 9th Aug 2007 4:47pm | |
L4Y Member
Post 5451 / 265
 |
No, that is not true, a beveled brush is just another face, it wouldnt and doesnt have any effect on portaling.
How about use your common sence and see what a portal would be best and most practically used in a door?  |
For anyone reading this in 2019 or later: The RF community is alive on the Community Discord
[Faction Files] |
|
|
Assaultman67  |
Posted 9th Aug 2007 10:49pm | |
Post 2434 / 4376
 |
Thats a little harsh ... |
|
|
| Enforce |
Posted 10th Aug 2007 6:43am |
L4Y Member
Post 80 / 312
|
Look ... I'm not talking about air Portals inside the doors...... I'm talking
about using Face Portals to split up certain rooms because they have their limits.
They don't work very well with rooms that have lots of bevels in them (like more than 3
sides bevelled). This is probably why the designers placed the face portals in
FLAT non-bevelled areas like in caves, or mini breaks in the level, ect and
the door portals were placed for the heavily bevelled sections of the maps like inside
buildings.
So they had to rely on a lot of door portals, they had no choice because the face
portals proved to be unstable in the non-flat areas as I have already found out
that when you have more than 4 sides of a room bevelled and you try to place
a face portal in that, the room dissapears off the map and turns from air to
solid and to get the room back to normal again you have to remove the portal
you can't change the brush back from solid to air under the normal brush
settings, they no longer work until you remove the portal......
So there are limits to the face Portals we were not told about in the help
section, that's why in their help section they showed only a diagraph
of using them in places like breaking up caves, they were ment for flat areas. |
| Red limits breached?, Yep, (20,000 fces and its still going !) |
Modified Aug 10th, 07:17am by Enforce |
|
| goober |
Posted 10th Aug 2007 2:15pm | |
L4Y Member
Post 5458 / 265
|
No, Beveled faces have no effect on being able to portal room, You've done something wrong, but its not beveling the face.
Just FYI - A cave's geometry is a whole lot more complex then a beveled room, and IF THIS WAS THE CASE (which it's NOT) then a cave would give you more trouble.
| Quote | So there are limits to the face Portals we were not told about in the help
section, |
Everything has limits, it's impossible for it not to. Portaling Beveled rooms is not one of them. Beveling does nothing to make your geometry any less clean.
On the other hand, if youve already clipped this brush and ended up with some weird faces with an insane amount of verticies and then beveled, you may have ended up with holes, but they are NOT caused by a portal. |
For anyone reading this in 2019 or later: The RF community is alive on the Community Discord
[Faction Files] |
|
|
| Enforce |
Posted 16th Aug 2007 3:44am |
L4Y Member
Post 86 / 312
|
Are you saying that I've found a flaw in the portals that dosen't exist?
Here's a Detail brush room with 2 bevelled sides and one solid face portal
running straight through the middle: As you can see the portal is stable, no
issues yet.
Now as soon as I start to bevel the right side of the room.
This is what happens
This is in FACE Mode viewport:
So where has my portal suddenly dissapeared to? The room colors are not showing anymore, the portal is no longer working, the room is no longer visible in the 3d rendering window, its just blank space... Care to start explaining what's going on with Red if you say that Bevelling a room dosen't have any effect on face portals?
It looks like Red is starting to lose it here...
Now Clicking back to normal brush mode I find the setting is set to air, yet the brush
is showing up when i click on the empty space and find its been changed into a
solid red wireframe ! The rendered room is no longer visible or recognized.
Now when I test the map. To see what happens, no can do, Red says
the Player is outside the start position, but the player is still inside the room
how can it be outside the start position unless there is no room anymore!
Interesting...
a serious flaw indeed!
Now if I just flip the Portal around to Horizontal, then the room renders
and the portal works and splits up the room and now we have a
another probem, HOLES now:
Holes appearing now in a detail brush?
But a cave has one level so you're fine. Im talking about maps that use
several LAYERS of bevelling that use it heavily, use it too heavy and look
what it done to my portal already!
So much for the theory that face portals aint affected when you bevel
a room.
Now if you bevel all the sides of the room..
Portal now only works in one position only and leaks are springing up
all over the place now, three holes now and in a detail brush too (shocking).
and the end result in the game when you run this in realtime?
Lol too funny... Detail brush room booleans have gone out the
window...
if you dont get the same result, then it must be a direct-x issue or somthing |
| Red limits breached?, Yep, (20,000 fces and its still going !) |
Modified Aug 16th, 04:15am by Enforce |
|
| Assaultman67 |
Posted 16th Aug 2007 4:04am | |
Post 2468 / 4376
|
have you tried replacing a face portal after you bevel? (cut and paste your portal face after you bevel and then rebuild)   ... |
| |
Modified Aug 16th, 04:04am by Assaultman67 |
|
| Enforce |
Posted 16th Aug 2007 4:49am |
L4Y Member
Post 87 / 312
|
Portal might only be stable for thick bevels, when I use a thin bevel, all I get is a grey coloured room, no color split to indicate portal is ok with this many bevels.
I getting different results with this |
| Red limits breached?, Yep, (20,000 fces and its still going !) |
|
|
| Assman15 |
Posted 16th Aug 2007 7:17am | |
Post 504 / 2085
|
Why is the room a detail brush? From my experiences making air brushes details is only asking for trouble. Brushes should only be details if they're a minor part of the layout; railings, columns, boxes, etc. Try to refrain from having any part of the main level structure being detail as it will only lead to problems. |
|
|
| goober |
Posted 16th Aug 2007 2:57pm | |
L4Y Member
Post 5497 / 265
|
First off Enforce, you seem to be extruding, not beveling.
Second, you seem to have a buggy brush to start with.
Thirdly your line "a hole in a detail brush?!" doesnt make any sence. A air, detail brush doesnt do anything. Contrary to Popular Belief, it does NOT act as though all its faces are detail face brushes. |
For anyone reading this in 2019 or later: The RF community is alive on the Community Discord
[Faction Files] |
|
|
| Ninja~ |
Posted 16th Aug 2007 8:17pm |
L4Y Member
Post 540 / 644
 |
| Quoting Enforce |
Now when I test the map. To see what happens, no can do, Red says
the Player is outside the start position, but the player is still inside the room
how can it be outside the start position unless there is no room anymore!
Interesting...
a serious flaw indeed!
|
When RED says that the player start position is outside the map.. It only means Single Player maps.. So If your map is Multiplayer, It does not matter.. |
|
|
|
|
